“Now, I would argue that during the entire eight years that I’ve been president, that spirit of America has still been there in all sorts of ways. It manifests itself in communities all across the country,” Obama told Axelrod.

“We see it in this younger generation that is smarter, more tolerant, more innovative, more creative, more entrepreneurial, would not even think about, you know, discriminating somebody against for example because of their sexual orientation. You know, all those things that I describe, you’re seeing in our society, particularly among 20-year-olds, 30-year-olds,” Obama said.

“But what I think we also saw is that the — the resistance to that vision of America, which has always been there, was always powerful, mobilized and asserted itself powerfully,” Obama asserted. “Now, I would argue that in part, very cynically, somebody like a Mitch McConnell or Roger Ailes at Fox News I think specifically mobilized a backlash to this vision in order to accomplish pretty routine, commercial or power … “

Axelrod then interrupted Obama to ask if McConnell’s opposition was really because he knew Obama figured out how to fix the country.

“It would’ve validated this vision and it would’ve reinforced it and — and it would have, I think, consolidated itself for a generation or two. And so Mitch McConnell’s insight, which I’ve — I’ve said, just from a pure tactical perspective, was pretty smart and well executed, the degree of discipline that he was able to impose on his caucus was impressive,” Obama asserted during his interview. “His insight was that we just have to say no to that.”

Obama then ceded that Republicans won seats in the House and the Senate during the course of his term in the White House, but that such gains were purely the result of McConnell and Ailes’ political maneuverings, not out of any bad feelings about his policies or the way he pursued them.

Obama campaigned heavily during the course of the 2016 election on behalf of Democratic nominee Hillary Clinton, but Trump campaigned against nearly all of Obama’s policies, including the Affordable Care Act, as well as Obama’s stance on immigration.